Managing different distros

[Sakamoto Ryōma]

Hello

I have different types of servers and I currently use Rocky Linux and Ubuntu for those different types. I selected Ubuntu as some server providers don't give rocky Linux options. But recently I thought about even if they don't support it, I can get base Ubuntu installed and change the distro to rocky Linux. Is this bad practice?

Some provider gives two latest option of versions like Rocky Linux 8 and 9, and Ubuntu 20.04 and 22.04. This is also another issue. Even if I select Rocky Linux for a type of server, I may not get the same version from datacenters. I think I have to use the latest versions because if I do not have a previous version option from a data centre, I need to downgrade the OS version. I think upgrading the version will be less problematic. So even if I will get Rocky 8, I can upgrade to 9 or 20 to 22.

If upgrading any distro to Rocky Linux 9 is not problematic, I would use Rocky Linux 9 on all servers.

Any suggestions from experienced seniors?

 

[Active8]

But recently I thought about even if they don't support it, I can get base Ubuntu installed and change the distro to rocky Linux. Is this bad practice?

I am not sure if this possible , one is DEBIAN other is RHEL based so totally different, did you done it before ?

 

[Richard G]

I don't know either. Some datacenters provide an option to install from a different .iso another way.
Does your provider only support Rocky and Ubuntu, not Almalinux also?

 

[Sakamoto Ryōma]

Actually, I have been managing servers for about 20 years but I never tried this. I thought it might be an option as I moved from Debian to Ubuntu in the past. As their base was the same, there was not an issue. So it is probably not possible to move from RHEL-based Linux to Debian-based one or vice versa.

I used different providers, and some do not have Almalinux and Rocky as an option. Therefore I decided to use Ubuntu for those servers. I have been using Centos for many years on all my servers. I'm not an Ubuntu fan but most providers always have it in their list either last x.04 LTS version or the previous one. Moreover Rocky and Alma Linux look like dead although they claim to not be on their own websites, but Red Hat announced they closed the source code to other distros. https://www.theregister.com/2023/06/23/red_hat_centos_move/ I don't want to but maybe it is better to stick with the latest Ubuntu x.04LTS version on all machines? And if we can't use Rocky and Alma Linux, the only free Linux option which is supported by DirectAdmin is Ubuntu (and Debian).

 

[Richard G]

but Red Hat announced they closed the source code to other distros.

Which Alma and Rocky already found a solution for. I don't see how they are dead. Especially not Alma because that is supported by Cloudlinux too. And Cloudlinux is used by a huge amount of hosting providers, not only on DA but also cPanel, so Alma will most certainly not be dead.

I'm almost sure you can't just convert RHEL to a Debian alike, because the codebase is indeed totally different.
If you want to stick or change to Ubuntu it's a choice, not a requirement. Benefit is that you can updated to major newer versions of the OS supported by the apt package manager, as to Alma (like Centos) does not have such option, only via external tools.
So that is a rael beneficial point for Debian and alikes.

It's a pity those providers you are using are running behind and not having Alma and/or Rocky as an option. So in those cases, you almost are bound to using Debian or derative when using those providers.

To me I don't think there is a "better to stick with", it's just a choice. But if you're looking for upgrading major systems later on, then Debian (and alike) migh be the best options because that's supported by their own package manager.

 

[Sakamoto Ryōma]

Which Alma and Rocky already found a solution for.

I said they claim they found a solution but RetHat's announcement is clear. Alma and Rocky are like Centos, so if RedHat does not share the source code with them, they are dead. They claim they found a solution but I'm not sure about it. Alma was saying 1:1 same with Rhel, but now saying ABI compatible, but I don't know what it exactly means.

 

[Richard G]

so if RedHat does not share the source code with them, they are dead.

But RedHat did not say that. They said they would not share the RHEL code anymore, but they keep sharing the Centos-stream code. So they are not dead, they can operate from there, they only have to make it more stable themselves, as Centos Stream is not the most stable one as it's more a prequel to RHEL.

As for ABI compatibility, I found this explanation:

AlmaLinux will be binary-compatible (or ABI-compatible), meaning applications that run on RHEL will run on AlmaLinux. Freed from complete parity with RHEL releases, however, means that AlmaLinux can: Accept bug fixes outside RHEL's release cycle.

In fact Ubuntu also uses newer stuff than the probably more stable Debian does. Seems to me (but I'm no guru) it's a bit of the same with RHEL and Alma/Rocky.

However, as said, it's a choice, if you don't trust it completely and don't want to risk any fuzz, have easier major OS updates and don't want to use Cloudlinux, then I see no reason for you for not using Debian or Ubuntu.

 

[Sakamoto Ryōma]

I researched this situation a little bit more and I found out the solution that Rocky and Alma found is Centos Stream. I personally would not prefer Centos Stream, that is why I moved to Rocky Linux from Centos previously. Centos was great.

Ubuntu LTS is not using newer stuff and has 5-year support. For example, I checked which PHP version comes default on both the latest LTS and Debian, the same 8.1 version. And further research on Debian vs Ubuntu LTS, and I found out a lot of people hate snaps on Ubuntu and move back to Debian. Some claim Ubuntu is more secure than Debian, here, and they also add Ubuntu may have vulnerabilities that Debian does not.

My first server was Debian-based, then I moved to Centos and used it for years. I used Ubuntu on some of my servers, actually without any control panel. I have chosen Ubuntu at that time as it has a very large user base and documentation online.

I think I will try Debian on one of my main servers and I may move everything to Debian in the long term.

 

[Richard G]

and I found out the solution that Rocky and Alma found is Centos Stream.

Yes that's what I wrote in my reply too.
That's indeed the same reason most of us changed to Alma/Rocky and some to Debian/Ubuntu.

Ubuntu LTS is not using newer stuff and has 5-year support.

I was talking about drivers, I heard it would have more modern drivers, especially for desktop use probably. I didn't look at PHP because that is compiled from Directadmin.
The article you pointed to is from 3 years ago. In ICT in 3 years loads of things happen, so it's not sure it still the same. But indeed it could still be accurate.

I'm no programmer or guru either, so I mostly look with "simple" eyes to this thing. What is the original, can I use that, then yes I do, can't I, then what is the most near next step. So can I use RHEL? Yes but costs money, next near step was Centos, also very stable, so use that.
If I only had the choice between Debian and Ubuntu, I would choose Debian, because that is the base system.
Is that wise? I don't know, sometimes newer things are better, sometimes not.

I don't use any Debian, so for me I hope dat Alma and Rocky will adjust things so they will be more stable than the Centos-Stream stuff. And we have too few servers and we are too old to start changing things now. I don't think, due to age, we still will be in business in 10 years.

 

[Sakamoto Ryōma]

I understand, I also don't like to change OS or providers. Rather fix the problem with current ones, but I'm already familiar with both systems Ubuntu is Debian-based, and others are RHEL-based. I would not move to any new environment for me such as Suse which I have no experience. Actually, OS is not that important, all Linux, and I use the bare minimum, rather I'm after long-term support, minimal time needed for management, and minimal problems Thank you for your suggestions, I'm building a new startup and I can't depend on the unknown state of Rocky, Alma Linux, although the support is relatively short on Debian, it's a reliable distro from my point of view.

 

[kristian]

I've been using Debian on servers (both DA and non-DA) for as long as I can remember. It's great.