This is my story
- Thread starter sb2009
- Start date
Richard G
Verified User
LoL.
Try the same with cPanel. They also request legal proof. If you don't apply they just shut you down.
Looks you're violating license agreement by not doing bundle sales.
Try the same with cPanel. They also request legal proof. If you don't apply they just shut you down.
Looks you're violating license agreement by not doing bundle sales.
Richard G
Verified User
Yep. Next to that he can't even proof having a website which he sells vps/servers on with DA as he didn't answer that question either.
Which is a mandatory thing in the license agreement.
Which is a mandatory thing in the license agreement.
- Joined
- Feb 27, 2003
- Messages
- 562
We appreciate that the community has noticed a consistent red flag: all these types of complaints seem to come from unnamed providers.
If they were genuinely being impacted, they’d be putting their name and website out there to prove it. Getting people on their side would be priority number one, and it would be so easy to prove.
Complaining from the shadows raises more questions than it answers. If anything, it shows that we might of had a reasonable basis for asking questions in the first place.
Even more bizarre is that we did not close the door in this particular case -- we are simply waiting for some formal documentation.
If they were genuinely being impacted, they’d be putting their name and website out there to prove it. Getting people on their side would be priority number one, and it would be so easy to prove.
Complaining from the shadows raises more questions than it answers. If anything, it shows that we might of had a reasonable basis for asking questions in the first place.
Even more bizarre is that we did not close the door in this particular case -- we are simply waiting for some formal documentation.
twhiting9275
Verified User
Well, that didn't exactly go as you expected!
I find it kind of funny that even on reddit, the crowd pretty much called out the user's BS. That's a rarity
I find it kind of funny that even on reddit, the crowd pretty much called out the user's BS. That's a rarity
Sure, you were happy to take your millions of dollars of profits years ago from anyone that gave you those hundred dollar bills at a time, and now requiring people to get notarized by embassies to now use the service they paid for. I sure love how you like to play victim even though you are the one that is stealing. How about you program MariaDB into the legacy codebase, and actually provide the legal obligation you agreed to when you sold the lifetime product? Or are you too busy sipping matinees on your yacht that was paid for with those lifetime licenses?
Richard G
Verified User
Which all did profit enormously from those major cheap internal licenses and also external licenses earned their money back.
Lifetime was never ever an "as long as you live" term, it's not a legal term and next to that, it does not exist in software world. Others just declare lifetime licenses "end of life". DA was so nice to fase it out so we can still use them for the time being.
Get a lifetime license from similar company's and see what you have to pay at a yearly base to keep them going. And you can always make use of the 15/month offer, at least as long as that still exists.
Because the almost only people blaiming DA are people who can't provide any proof they were entitled anyway to internal lifetime licenses anyway. And some legal from which most earned back their licenses cost multiple times.
For external license (if not bought 2nd hand for half the money) you paid ONCE 300 dollar and could use it at the very least for 6 years.
So where did DA make the millions? You know what developpers cost per year? Guess not.
You will find nothing like this anywhere in the softwareworld comparable.
Next to that, it's still lifetime compared to other "lifetime" licenses. You can keep using them with the old software.
You can't keep running a business for years on a 1 time income.
- Joined
- Feb 27, 2003
- Messages
- 562
You're right. By that definition, it wouldn't be a lifetime.
In the software industry, lifetime of any product/license is a timespan set by the developer, which is why terms like EOL exist. It would be highly unusual, even bizarre, to have software lifecycles tied to medical metrics (like biological longevity).
The best any software company can do is take your payment, return good value for the price, and retain some profit to keep itself afloat. When this is no longer possible, product tiers get dropped (EOL), regardless of billing method (in fact, many recurring-billed licenses are part of our legacy codebase).
The proper definition is:
Lifetime (of any license) = Until EOL
There is nothing unlawful or unethical about it -- this is true of every software that has ever existed. For those yelling "scam" -- keep in mind we have been developing these licenses for over 20 years with 250+ releases. We have shown exceptionally good faith but there is only so far you can drive on one tank of gas. We are showing further good faith by following a sunsetting process, which is a precursor to formal EOL: a slow wind-down rather than a harsh one where everything (including licensing/login) could stop working in a heartbeat.
So you admit you didn't actually provide a lifetime which is what was advertised? That "tank of gas" earned you millions and millions. You are still sitting pretty on all those sales. Stop playing a victim when you made bank and now refuse to honor what you sold. YOU MADE MILLIONS IF NOT MULTIPLE MILLIONS. There is no reason that you have stopped supporting the legacy codebase other than your own greed. If you didn't intend to meet your obligations you shouldn't have offered a lifetime product, and that is the truth. It was completely unethical of you to sell it otherwise and that is the truth. At least don't lie to yourself when you steal and scam people. You owed those 250+ releases and more because that is what you sold. You deserve a class action lawsuit because you lied.
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@DavidK , I wish you the best in life. The way you see things is certainly unique. Yes, you purchased a lifetime license—but it's important to understand that there's always some interpretation involved when it comes to the term lifetime.
So, when would you consider it fulfilled?
The point is: nothing in life lasts forever.
And why do you keep saying Class action lawsuit? You can find an attorney today(?)
So, when would you consider it fulfilled?
- When your server dies?
- When you die?
- When the Earth explodes?
The point is: nothing in life lasts forever.
And why do you keep saying Class action lawsuit? You can find an attorney today(?)
Richard G
Verified User
So you admit you are unable to read?
Just some things I see.
1.) Since when did they stop support the legacy codebase? As @ericosman already asked, did your server die? Isn't all still working?
2.) No intention to meet a lifetime product? So then why is the lifetime product supported already 22 years? They stopped selling 6 years ago, but it's still supported, so where is the lack of intention here?
3.) In software world, you can check up -every- software around like they say: Lifetime = until EOL. And they didn't even declare EOL yet and legacy licenses still get some new features, in spite of the fact that they announce no new features on legacy. So where is the lying and the lack of intend?
Did they earn a bunch of money in the past on those licenses? Sure, which company didn't. Plesk and cPanel earned way more and still do, but only DA is picked on, while they are just being nice and especially always have been fair. Try get a half price lifetime modern license with them!!
Money earned in the past is gone, people get paid, investments made and ofcourse there is money earned too, otherwise it's no use to start a business. If that is lying, cheating and worth a lawsuit, then it migh be best to find a lawyer to start a lawsuit against yourself.
I don't really think my opinion is that unique honestly. The bigger story is not even the "datacenter" licenses which you could at least argue that some people didn't qualify for and hence could have their licenses removed (which on the other hand didn't directadmin have some responsibility to do due diligence in the first place before selling such licenses to make sure they are actually selling to a datacenter?).
The bigger story to me is they sold retail lifetime licenses for $300 which in that case anyone who ordered was qualified and they are reneging on that obligation by not supporting future MariaDB instances.
And no, I don't think your average reasonable person purchasing a product advertised as lifetime thinks the company can just declare it EOL whenever they feel like it, unless they go out of business.
No one is buying "lifetime" thinking the product is only good for 20 years.
Otherwise, why not sell a 20 year license? You know why? Because directadmin would have sold a lot less licenses if they advertised it as such.
$300 was a heck of a lot to spend for a lot of small businesses and they probably wouldn't have sold a lot of people if they have honestly advertised it as dying in 20 years. And yes, not supporting future MariaDB versions is in reality the death of the license.
The bigger story to me is they sold retail lifetime licenses for $300 which in that case anyone who ordered was qualified and they are reneging on that obligation by not supporting future MariaDB instances.
And no, I don't think your average reasonable person purchasing a product advertised as lifetime thinks the company can just declare it EOL whenever they feel like it, unless they go out of business.
No one is buying "lifetime" thinking the product is only good for 20 years.
Otherwise, why not sell a 20 year license? You know why? Because directadmin would have sold a lot less licenses if they advertised it as such.
$300 was a heck of a lot to spend for a lot of small businesses and they probably wouldn't have sold a lot of people if they have honestly advertised it as dying in 20 years. And yes, not supporting future MariaDB versions is in reality the death of the license.
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20 years × 12 months = 240 months.
$300 divided by 240 = $1.25 per month… I really hope the people working at DirectAdmin either married a rich partner or have another job.
Even if they sold 5-year licenses for the same amount of money, it would still be a fantastic deal.
There’s something important to understand: the meaning of words can change depending on how they are used.
For example:
$300 divided by 240 = $1.25 per month… I really hope the people working at DirectAdmin either married a rich partner or have another job.
Even if they sold 5-year licenses for the same amount of money, it would still be a fantastic deal.
There’s something important to understand: the meaning of words can change depending on how they are used.
For example:
- "Cool" can mean low temperature ("The weather is cool")
- Or something nice or impressive ("That car is so cool!")
Richard G
Verified User
Again. You're wrong. You can argue what you want, but provide proof of any other software business doing this, especially similar software if you think you're right.
I had a vbulletin lifetime license for example. So at a certain point they declared it end of life. End of story. I can still use it, just not upgrade. It's common practice in software land to declare software EOL, you even see that on the free licenses like PHP for example.
Nobody is selling a "10 year license" or "20 year license" as in PC and software land these are unknown terms, ICT is unpredictable so that is just not possible. So to sell something which is ment to last as long as reasonably possible, they use the term lifetime.
Again, nowhere the term lifetime is legally (so by law) specfied and certainly not for software.
In our interpretation and looking in dictionary can be either:
1.) As long as the owner hime/her self lives (not his heirs or family)
2.) As long as the company lives (until going out of business or broke)
3.) Until it's declared end of life, which is an option used with software.
Lot of people think it has to be 1 or 2, but it's not. There is no legal term and with software in almost all cases option 3 is ment.
You're not the only one paying external license for 300 dollar. Lots of us did. Are a lot of us angry or dissapointed too? Sure, we got 6 of these licenses. But we are professional too and understand that at a certain point it just ends. Anger is an emotion, it fades away when realism starts getting through.
Proof us that what you state is happening somewhere in software land with much used software which gives updates that many. Which DA still does.
Another question
And if they had said 10 years for 300 dollars, would you have said no? I'm sure you wouldn't have, see the math of @ericosman.
Neither would anyone else have.
So again:
1.) Proof that what you are saying is normal in software land, because there ware way more examples that it's not.
2.) Find my -any- company now or in the past selling licenses for a certain amount of years as you say DA should have done.
Well I think you guys convinced me. If it came out to $1.25/month then I guess it was reasonable that they eventually had to make changes.
And yeah other software providers like vbulletin didn't keep sending updates forever. I'm going to let go of my bitterness.
I'm launching a new web hosting company right now.. and in the past I would have tried to sell directadmin since I know it well.
At one point I converted my old legacy license to the $15/month deal, but I let it expire since I was still pissed off at directadmin.
That might have been a mistake since now my only option is the $29/month for my main server.
I'm currently using ISPmanager, which is pretty good but i'm still learning it since it works different.
ISPmanager is about $20/month.. so i'll probably stick with that and resell it for new clients who want VPS or Dedicated servers.
I probably should have stuck with the $15/month directadmin deal when I had the chance and had resolved myself to resell further licenses at $29/month for VPS and dedicated.. but I can't undue past decisions.
Haven't really made up my mind on that (ISPmanager vs Directadmin) but you've opened my mind that it maybe it wasn't completely unfair.
And yeah other software providers like vbulletin didn't keep sending updates forever. I'm going to let go of my bitterness.
I'm launching a new web hosting company right now.. and in the past I would have tried to sell directadmin since I know it well.
At one point I converted my old legacy license to the $15/month deal, but I let it expire since I was still pissed off at directadmin.
That might have been a mistake since now my only option is the $29/month for my main server.
I'm currently using ISPmanager, which is pretty good but i'm still learning it since it works different.
ISPmanager is about $20/month.. so i'll probably stick with that and resell it for new clients who want VPS or Dedicated servers.
I probably should have stuck with the $15/month directadmin deal when I had the chance and had resolved myself to resell further licenses at $29/month for VPS and dedicated.. but I can't undue past decisions.
Haven't really made up my mind on that (ISPmanager vs Directadmin) but you've opened my mind that it maybe it wasn't completely unfair.
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Richard G
Verified User
Thank you for being so fair to also post this in public, just as you posted your bitterness.
Be aware that we all felt like you last year, so we really understand the emotion, but as you can see when realism comes up after a bit of time it all starts to make sense.
Very pity indeed about the $15/month deal. Still... if you want to go back to DA now or later on, the good point it that it's still way cheaper than the paid competition, even with the full $29/month.
And... who's life after all? I agree that you must also eat like all of us, but I dont remember that you specified who's life is in this discussion when you sold those licenses. My conclusion (correct me if I am wrong) is that you let us think that directadmin's life, the software itself is the meaning of "for life". Because if my server dies... I replace some hardware or buy a new one and the server is alive again. If you die.... I wouldnt know, sombody else will take your place. If I die, who cares, and some lask of notification. BUT, if directadmin dissapears..... that's the EOL for licenses I bought. I hope you will not take my ideea and change the product name
If you do that, you'll deserve a collective trial. But I am happy with directadmin right now... still working and mariadb old database is not a problem till now. Let see the future.